On this episode of Listen to the Helpers, Amanda Sullivan joins Sarah and Kenzee to discuss her role as a Social Worker, and what inspires her to do this important work as a helper.
Listen to the full episode below:
Sarah Goehring: Welcome back to Listen to the Helpers, a podcast created by the Fred Rogers Institute to elevate the voices of helpers everywhere. Fred Rogers once said, "When I was a boy and would see scary things in the news, my mother would say to me, look for the helpers. You will always find people who are helping." Today, we're joined by Amanda Sullivan, a social worker in Ashville, North Carolina. At the end of the episode, stay tuned as Kenzee and I reflect on our discussion with Amanda in the context of Fred Rogers legacy and our own work at the Fred Rogers Institute.
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Sarah: So Amanda, thank you so much for joining us on this episode of Listen to the Helpers. We're so thankful to have you here.
Amanda Sullivan: Thank you for having me.
Sarah: So to start off, we'd love to ask you a little bit about yourself. Can you tell us who you are, where you are, and what you do?
Amanda: Yes. So, um, my name is Amanda Sullivan. I am a social worker. I live in Ashville, North Carolina, and I'm a social worker for people on the spectrum. So, I'm a therapist. I see people of all ages, but I specialize and my true joy is working in the early intervention area. So, working with children and their parents. um when they're under four years old.
Sarah: That is such important work. That's really really interesting that you do that work.
Kenzee Knott: Yeah. What led you to that path?
Amanda: Oo. Um so I have a a cousin who is autistic. Um and he's almost 30 now, maybe 30 years old. So I kind of heard about autism when I was younger. Um and just thought it was uh really interesting a different perspective that people have on the world. And so I thought um I was always curious, right? I like connecting with people and figuring out how they see the world and really seeing people. So um I think in high school I started volunteering with Special Olympics growing up. I was kind of like, you know how we all have identities when we're younger? Like I was athletic. So I was like I was the athlete, but I'm 5'1, so that was really never going to be a long-term thing. But I was like, well, how I do what I enjoy, which is sports, but also kind of um had this interest in people uh working with people with disabilities. So, I volunteered with Special Olympics and I found that just so enjoyable, so fun, meeting new people, um bringing together like what I love, sports, and um also helping, you know, other individuals enjoy it as well. So, um, yeah, that I didn't really know what I wanted to do long term, but I kind of recognized I wanted to work with people, um, especially those with disabilities. So, I, um, went to school, kind of did human development, early education, thinking maybe I wanted to be a teacher. Um, quickly realized that teacher schedules are pretty difficult and challenging. And so I actually ended up going into social work. So I um again just knew I still wanted to work with kids um especially disabilities, especially autism. And honestly like every job that I had kind of followed um that path and then I ended up uh here at the UNC TEACCH Autism Program.
Sarah: Wow, that's so interesting. And um that's really neat that your your path led you to that specific role, especially because there was some time of like, oh, maybe I want to do this, maybe I want to be a teacher. So, it's it's great that you found your place in what what you were supposed to do. Can you tell us a little bit more about like what a day-to-day looks like in your job as a social worker?
Amanda: Yes. Um, so I see uh clients like individually um sometimes just doing uh more talk therapy adapted for neurodiverse individuals. Um and then with the early intervention I'm I'm really in the room with the parents and the child um helping I think the parents to understand kind of the language of autism. We call it autism learning styles and it's just a different way that the brain um for individuals on the spectrum how they learn differently. Um and that can affect really young younger kiddos in terms of uh building connections with their parents. I think parents are really trying to have um you know social engagement with their child and some of the strategies that I give parents are to help build that and build connections between those between the two of them. Um, so that's kind of what I do today. Like coaching parents on like, wait, let's try something different so we can really meet your child where they're at and um kind of respect and enhance like all of the wonderful qualities of their child, but also help parents get reciprocity and communication and engagement for their young toddlers.
Kenzee: That's amazing. Um, like I'm just curious, what type of strategies do you offer to build that connection?
Amanda: Yeah, great question. So first it's starting with psycho education for the parents right many parents either if their child is um the child's on the spectrum as their first child uh you know they don't really understand you know why an autistic brain is different than a neurotypical brain. So we kind of give some of the language um and just differences like in auditory processing, in executive functioning um implicit learning differences. Um and then we use what we call really naturalistic strategies. So um showing parents ways to engage in a way that respects their child's learning. Um so building social fun. Um building sorry social connections through fun like play naturalistic play um building opportunities for again reciprocity so that there's like back and forth um uh between the mom and the child or the dad and the child whomever comes into the session I get grandparents as well foster parents uh I think that for me is the most important part of um my therapy. And then TEACCH itself also uh teaches parents. We also have like trainings for teachers in how to modify the environment to be more successful um for people on the spectrum because unfortunately this is a neurotypical world. It's not designed for people with sensory differences. So part of my role is to advocate and help neurotypical people make changes that are going to help an an individual on the spectrum be more successful in their day-to-day life. So making clearer expectations with visuals and u more concrete clues and um just under ways to understand their environment.
Sarah: That's so interesting and that's such that's such important work and I'm that that's really refreshing to hear that you are are such a strong advocate for these families and these children um who learn differently and who interpret the world differently. Um so you mentioned that you know you you help the people that you work with and I I would consider you a helper for sure. That's why we asked you to be on this podcast. But we'd like to know what it means to you to be a helper.
Amanda: Yeah. Um to me to be a helper um or being a helper means seeing where there can be areas of improvement, knowing that there is if there's something wrong, stepping in, taking action. Um even if maybe even not something's wrong, if something could be better, right? Um helping is seeing what could be better in the world and um doing it.
Sarah: Yeah. Yeah, I love that. And I feel like that that is a key piece that doing it is a key piece of being a helper because a lot of people can recognize something that either could be better or something that is wrong in the world, whether it's, you know, in their personal sphere of life or in like the world as a whole, but not everybody does that doing it part to to actually make a difference and make a change um that they would like to see. So, I love that you mentioned that.
Kenzee: Kind of switching lanes to um Sarah said the recognized. So, talking about the unrecognized um is there something you wish you that people knew about what you do as a social social worker. Um I think I mean partly seeing that there are people who you know do the helping and do that work but it also is uh intrinsically motivating for me and many helpers to it feels good to be a helper in any kind of capacity whether that's a profession or in a small way. Um, and I wish that it was kind of seen like that, I think, on a societal standpoint because helpers are essential, right? This individuals with disabilities are here. They need us. Um, and we need to adjust our society to support them. And, you know, not even just people with disabilities like teachers and all these uh individuals that are highly undervalued in our society. Um, I wish that it was kind of seen as a profession that people get benefits from and was treated that way, you know, um, with higher pay, just value and and respect and um, seeing it as this is a profession profession that people should want to go into and um, we should be able to support them doing that.
Sarah: Absolutely. That's Yeah, that's that rings true on so many levels. I I know Kenzee and I both went to college for education degrees and so before working at the institute we both anticipated becoming teachers and Kenzee I don't know if you've had experiences like this but all throughout my college experience I would have people from my hometown or people from my extended family with the whole like oh you're going to be a teacher that you know that doesn't pay much and it's like not why I'm going into the field. Maybe I genuinely want to teach or maybe I want to help people like maybe it's not about the money and it would be nice if there was money as well but maybe that's not the reason why I want to do what I want to do. So I yeah that's that struck a chord with me.
Amanda: Yeah. I remember having a conversation with someone um when I was choosing where I wanted what I wanted to do for grad school um and it was like between special education teacher and social worker. They were like, you know, neither of those are really lucrative careers. I was like, no, you're right. But if they were, more people would go into them. I really enjoyed it. That's why I want to do it. And I wish it was treated as a lucrative career because then we would um, you know, have, you know, education be highly valued and support for minorities and disabled populations would be more prioritized and funding for them.
Sarah: Yes. Because we need people like you. We need a role. We need teachers. We need, you know, helpers, like you said, they're essential. We need them. So, we want people to be in those roles and it's it's really inspiring you talk about the things that you love about your job and the reasons why you do your job. So, that that's it's really wonderful to hear your story.
Amanda: Thank you.
Sarah: Um, so that actually leads me to another question that we have for you is do you have a story about a time that you maybe remembered your why? I I can imagine that um there are many tough times, tough days I should say, in your in your career and maybe things don't always go exactly how you want them to or exactly as planned, but um amidst any of the toughness um was there a time when you had something where you thought, okay, yeah, this is why I do what I do?
Amanda: Yeah. Um when I was in college, every summer I worked at a camp for kids with special needs. So, all you know, learning disabilities, behavioral disabilities, autism as well. And I worked with a um a young kiddo from New York and just he had some, you know, emotional behavioral challenges. This was his first time at camp. And I remember spending a lot of time with him and being super just invested in getting to know him. I learned a lot from him um and helping him be more successful in that group setting. So, he felt successful and by the end of the summer like he and I were super tight. You know, I I I learned like the kids that I spent the most time with and I took the time to see who they are and it was a mutual respect and um that kind of relationship. Those were the kids that I like fell in love with, right? really um quote unquote tough kids when they arrived at camp, but really just needed someone to see them and be there for them. And then uh so that was one summer and then I went back the next summer and you know the buses pull in from New York. They bus in a lot of kids to this out um this camp and they arrived and I like got a little tap on my shoulder and I saw the kid behind me and he just like gave me a huge hug and I was like, "Oh, like I'm so glad you're here." it was so good to see you. Um, so just knowing like that I uh but I made a difference for him and um he made a huge difference for me kept me going and really interested in kind of pursuing more of a career in that field whereas before it had just been um you know an interest but not necessarily something I wanted to do long term but yeah that definitely solidified it for me.
Sarah: Oh, that's such a special story and that must have felt so good to really like you hope that everybody that you work with, I'm sure that you leave that lasting impact with them. But to actually get that of like you remembered me and like you were I was just like, that's so amazing.
Kenzee: Thank you so much, Amanda. Um, I just have one final question for you. Um, do you have any final thoughts for our listeners?
Amanda: I hope that there are, you know, families that are talking about these conversations and having these conversations. Um, I think it's important for kids at a young age to hear that there are helpers and not just that that they could be helpers, but the helpers are out there already helping them to recognize like you have people in your life already that are making a difference and you could um become that person as well.
Sarah: Oh, I love that. Thank you so much for sharing that. And thank you so much for your time to talk with us today. It's been great getting to know you and um we hope to stay connected after this too.
Amanda: Yes. Thank you so much for having me.
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Sarah: That was so much fun talking with Amanda about her job as a social worker and the important work that she's doing for children and families with children who have autism.
Kenzee: Yeah, it was absolutely amazing getting to talk to her and learn more about her work as a social worker. Um, is there anything that immediately stuck out to you in that conversation?
Sarah: I loved hearing her story about her, you know, time that she remembered her why that story of that um, one little boy who came back from the camp and gave her a big hug. And I feel like that I feel like that reminded me of um the story of when Fred Rogers started his television career and then he was given the advice to think of that one little buckaroo on the other side of the screen and that that her Amanda's story was reminding me of that that you know obviously she she clearly makes an impact on a lot of people that she works with and works for, but at the end of the day, she made an impact for sure on that one little boy, that one little buckaroo. Did that conversation with Amanda remind you of any of the fundamentals of learning and growing?
Kenzee: Oh, it definitely did. It made me think a little bit of both self-worth and trust, which I feel like just both of those fundamentals came up a lot in all of the work that she does. like she's helping both the child and the child's families really gain confidence in understanding their child's autism and how to best support and assist in that. And not only that, they trust her and that's reciprocated in order to build that connection in community as well as she advocates for them.
Sarah: Yeah, her job is so clearly grounded in relationships and relationships always makes me think of trust. Obviously, all of the six fundamentals are kind of interwoven in relationships and building relationships, but trust I feel like is so essential in developing that connection with somebody and especially in the role that she's in. You have to have that trust to be able to work with a family and their child. I also I kind of have looking and listening carefully in the back of my mind as well because um as she was talking about the recommendations or um the things that she suggests for families, it seems like it is as it should be very tailored to a specific child and to a specific family. So on her end, she's really needing to look and listen carefully to who this child is, who this family is. And then the family is also having to look and listen carefully to be able to say this is who my family is or this is who my child is. And um let me hear what your recommendations are and let me really take the time to to put that into effect to do what's best and maybe change the environment so that my child um and my family can be more successful.
Kenzee: Yeah. And I really liked um and I think a little bit of Fred comes in here where she talked about meeting the ch like the child where they are um which I thought was really important not about changing the child but as you said changing the environment to best support the child.
Sarah: Yes, that's so important that you're absolutely right that she was definitely talking about meeting the child where they are and meeting the family where they are. I love that she she was focused on the children that she works with, but she mentioned over and over again about the families as well because the child is a part of that family. That family is a part of that child and it's it's not just a one-on-one that she works with the whole family. That was really that was really interesting to hear. And um she yeah, it was just so inspiring to hear her story and how she just genuinely loves being a helper. That's so that's so refreshing and so wonderful to hear,
Kenzee: right? And also kind of adding to the name of the podcast, look for the helpers, listen to the helpers. Um, a lot of the work that they do engage in is unnoticed and unrecognized in a lot of ways. So, kind of looking towards the vast range of helpers as we are in this podcast and just in life in general.
Sarah: Yes. And I think this can kind of lead into something that we can ask our listeners to do. Um, Amanda mentioned that she would encourage people and children to think about the helpers that are in the world right now, not not just the helpers that could be, but I'm wondering if maybe we could ask our listeners to think about those helpers that are in your life. And if you have a child in your life, whether it's um your own child or a niece or a nephew, a grandchild, um encourage them to think about who are the helpers in your community right now. Um yes, it's fun to think about what kind of helper could you be, but um in the spirit of thinking in the present and looking for the helpers that are in the world around us at this very moment in time. Um we encourage you to think about that and and encourage the children in your life to think about that, too.
Kenzee: Great. Thank you so much, Sarah,
Sarah: And thank you, Amanda, for joining us today.
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Kenzee: The Fred Rogers Institute advances the legacy of Fred Rogers by investing in the strengths of families and caring adults to support the healthy development of children. To learn more about the Fred Rogers Institute in our initiatives, visit fredrogersinstitute.org and follow the Fred Rogers Institute on Instagram, Facebook, LinkedIn, and X.
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